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  1. #1
    Guest Gator eye's Avatar
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    Default Technology vs. Tradition

    With bows crossing the 300 fps mark, and inline muzzle loaders reaching 200 yards plus, and more states are including crossbows in there bow season. Electronic calls, custom seeds and food plots, GPS, sprays,scents, specailized camo,range finders,....ect.. Hunting has really changed and advanced in the last 10 to 15 years.

    Is there a line we are crossing where we are not giving the game we hunt a fair chance. Where is the fair chase of shooting a deer with muzzleloader at 200 yard in a primitive season? Or using a cross bow to hit at fifty plus yards during bow season. Are we going to be shooting deer at 1500 yards with a muzzle loading super charge x-ray flint lock laser gun, while sitting at the coffee table in the middle of the living room and calling it fair chase?

    Where and how do we draw the line on all the techno gizmos we use to shoot deer? When does fair chase turn lopsided or is it already there?

  2. #2

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gator eye View Post
    Is there a line we are crossing where we are not giving the game we hunt a fair chance. Where is the fair chase of shooting a deer with muzzleloader at 200 yard in a primitive season? Or using a cross bow to hit at fifty plus yards during bow season. Are we going to be shooting deer at 1500 yards with a muzzle loading super charge x-ray flint lock laser gun, while sitting at the coffee table in the middle of the living room and calling it fair chase?

    Where and how do we draw the line on all the techno gizmos we use to shoot deer? When does fair chase turn lopsided or is it already there?
    I still don't see a huge advantage. It technology is helping but until you see harvest rates climb, I'm not sure you can really say that technology has help to the point of being detrimental. If I am right, I think Illinois bow hunter harvest rates are like 20%.
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  3. #3
    Guest Gator eye's Avatar
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    I think technology has help us a lot with accurancy and reducing the number of critters that get wounded every year. I know the old darton I first started hunting with is nothing compaired to the high dollar rig I shoot with now, I would never want to go back to that bow.
    I am just worried that with each new advancment in hunt technolgy were taking away from the real hunting. How to find game, how to get close to game, how to skillfully take a game killing shot.

  4. #4
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    I don't think so... no matter what is out there it still isn't as accurate as the guns that have been used over the last 100 years.

    While there are a lot of "advances" that are out there now the truth is its still the same. Most people with compounds aren't shooting any further then people used to shoot with longbows. If anything "technology" is making it worse as we lose area to expanding population and homes.

    Food plots are nothing new, farmers have been doing it for centuries. Post on the edge and shoot.
    No I'm not dead

  5. #5
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    I think technology has helped a lot with 'ethical' hunting due to increased accuracy and the potential for reduced human error. Overpopulation is also an issue to consider. I would rather see meat in a freezer, in a crock pot and on somebody's dinner plate than smeared down the highway.

    Ron

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    Wow this is a really debatable subject here..... Their are lots of things that can go as yes or no as fair chase. Theirs alot of things to help hunters take a animal now, then their was way back when, but the animals are also getting wiser and harder to harvest. You hear all kinds of storys about how deer learn to look in trees, their more skiddish in open areas, ext, plus they can see, pickup movment and smell much better then us, I really cant tell you what fair chase is, I just follow the rules set by the state. Now you cant only point this are archery and muzzel loaders, what about general gun areas? Ive seen lots of guys take elk at 500, 600 yards. With the new big bore long range guns and ranging scopes, its not all that tough, if you know how to use your equipment. Im sure it will also get worse as time goes on, technoligy will aid hunters more and more.

  7. #7
    And thats no lie ! poorman's Avatar
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    I dont think we (hunters) have any more of an advantge than before. Just better equipment. Sure we take more deer now but ther eare more deer now. Do we shoot deer/elk at 500 yards? You bet. Did they do years ago with the sharps rifles? You bet. We do have better equipment but the botto line is a good hunter will kill no matter what his equipment. So that guy that shot his deer at 50 yards with his new bow still would have killed a deer he just would have waited till he had a 30 yard shot. I believe it is still fair chase.
    That course was so easy I even missed a target !!

  8. #8
    bambi killer killbambidead's Avatar
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    even with all the new high tech stuff do you still kill a big old buck every year ? the deer arent stupid they get smarter every time you go out to hunt

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    Gator Eye, I relate with where you are coming from. True we have much better equipment than we had say 20yrs ago. Remember we we all did backward cartwheels when our bows broke 200fps. I'll have to stay best advice for bowhunters now is to shoot what feels right to you. Let face it we owe it to the game we pursue to give them our best shot. For me I'll just settle for one deer a year with my bow shooting one pin, fingers and at best about 220-230 fps, Cam

  10. #10
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    I think the real problem with the technology is the manner isn which it is sometimes employed. Better optics, rangefinders, faster bows GPS, can lead a mediocre hunter into a false sense of invincibility and let him encourage himself into risky shots and dangerous situations. It's not the technology per se but the mis-application of it that poses the danger.

  11. #11
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    I dont think of a GPS as a hunting aid. More of a peice of mind.

  12. #12
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    The Stone Age didn't end because they ran out of Stones.
    Fair chase is a state of mind. That is a choice. Anyone who can afford it can hunt in a zoo. You can have African Game trucked to your driveway.
    Teddy Roosevelt didn't shoot the bear tied to a tree. It's a matter of choice what we do and use, and what kind of Sportsmen we will are and will be.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sniper View Post
    The Stone Age didn't end because they ran out of Stones.
    Fair chase is a state of mind. That is a choice. Anyone who can afford it can hunt in a zoo. You can have African Game trucked to your driveway.
    Teddy Roosevelt didn't shoot the bear tied to a tree. It's a matter of choice what we do and use, and what kind of Sportsmen we will are and will be.
    Nice point...

    Ron

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    Quote Originally Posted by bullspotter View Post
    I dont think of a GPS as a hunting aid. More of a peice of mind.
    All the same when it fails you had better be able to navigate yourself out of the bush.

  15. #15
    Guest Gator eye's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bullspotter View Post
    I dont think of a GPS as a hunting aid. More of a peice of mind.

    How many people in 3D land can really use a compass anymore?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gator eye View Post
    How many people in 3D land can really use a compass anymore?
    I can, and a topo map.... but a GPS is about 10,000 times better!
    No I'm not dead

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gator eye View Post
    How many people in 3D land can really use a compass anymore?
    How many people use a calculator or computer instead of doing the math?
    Using a GPS is great, but does make us lazy and will change the way we use a compass... same as the computer has changed the way we do our math. Or how a compound changed the way we shoot a bow.

    Technology does make hunting easier or maybe more convenient at times... but you also can't say technology will increase the kill ratio of an animal due to so many other variables.

  18. #18
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    Trust me with all the technology we have I still do not kill deer every year. For me its definately fair chase.


    "HONDA"

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dredly View Post
    I can, and a topo map.... but a GPS is about 10,000 times better!
    Until your batteries run out... I do agree GPS is the way to go for a primary navigation means. You can get a pretty nice easy to use GPS these days for $100. But, the rule is to never rely on a single, especially electronic, means to navigate. I can name a dozen different things that can screw up a GPS or electronic compass. Magnetic compass backup should be in your pack for sure.

    I always carry a compass and note which direction I set out in, even if I know the property. Fog and/or heavy rain/snow comes in and you are completely disoriented. Partially due to the fact that you cannot see and partially due to the fact that your mind is spending too much time dealing with the physical conditions instead of the puzzle of getting back to where you came from. You can walk around in circles and not even realize it.

    A long time ago I was in an 'orienteering' club. Sounds weird but it was a lot of fun. I have no clue if anyone does that anymore. It's basically a game of using a topo map and compass to get from one place to another, capture the flag style... It was a very humbling thing for me to do even though I was taught basic navigation in Boyscouts.

    Ron

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ronhop View Post
    Until your batteries run out... I do agree GPS is the way to go for a primary navigation means. You can get a pretty nice easy to use GPS these days for $100. But, the rule is to never rely on a single, especially electronic, means to navigate. I can name a dozen different things that can screw up a GPS or electronic compass. Magnetic compass backup should be in your pack for sure.

    I always carry a compass and note which direction I set out in, even if I know the property. Fog and/or heavy rain/snow comes in and you are completely disoriented. Partially due to the fact that you cannot see and partially due to the fact that your mind is spending too much time dealing with the physical conditions instead of the puzzle of getting back to where you came from. You can walk around in circles and not even realize it.

    A long time ago I was in an 'orienteering' club. Sounds weird but it was a lot of fun. I have no clue if anyone does that anymore. It's basically a game of using a topo map and compass to get from one place to another, capture the flag style... It was a very humbling thing for me to do even though I was taught basic navigation in Boyscouts.

    Ron
    Very well put Ron.

    I think orienteering gave way to geocaching with GPS these days. There used to be a few clubs in Canada here that did orienteering with mountain bikes a few years ago, but I do not know if they still exist.

    Heck I heard that even Annapolis had stopped teaching stellar navigation due to GPS. Frightening given that Bush has demanded the ability to shut down the GPS sattelites on demand

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