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Old 06-01-2010, 10:43 PM   #41
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You honestly need to go talk to some of these pros and get answers from them why they do what they do. I use to have several posting at AT untell several just flat told them they were wrong.

Nathan Brooks and Eric Griggs took time to post how they shot BT after I ask them to post there. It got so crazy everyone telling them they were doing it wrong. Chance even mentioned he shoots BT that way. Sure didnt take long for the pros to stop posting on archery forums.

You certianly cant blame them for not posting. I researched B Stingers and talked to so many before switching. They dont BS and they dont lie. They do look for what makes them shoot well. Attend a Pro am and go up and talk and ask them what there reasons for using that product. See if you feel there looking you right in the face and not telling you the truth.
DB

They are still there . Just laying low. I for one do not tell anyone they are wrong. Ever. Just simply because no one is the same. Take me for instance. I lean back at full draw. Not because my DL is too long or anything like that. I fell 40 feet onetime and got busted up pretty bad. I have to lean back for it to be comfortable enough for me to shoot due to back damage.

Not getting into the stab thing.
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Old 06-01-2010, 10:53 PM   #42
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They are still there . Just laying low. I for one do not tell anyone they are wrong. Ever. Just simply because no one is the same. Take me for instance. I lean back at full draw. Not because my DL is too long or anything like that. I fell 40 feet onetime and got busted up pretty bad. I have to lean back for it to be comfortable enough for me to shoot due to back damage.

Not getting into the stab thing.
Its so compititve on that level. Just like the stabilizer buissness.
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Old 06-01-2010, 10:56 PM   #43
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Pros obviously dont have a qlue what works. I wouldnt dare try something that seems to be working for alot of pros. Just would not try that product. Just doesnt make sense to try it.
DB
I wasn't saying anything about doubting your info, the Pros or B-Stingers so don't blow up on me
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Old 06-01-2010, 11:30 PM   #44
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I wasn't saying anything about doubting your info, the Pros or B-Stingers so don't blow up on me
Your qoute

DB, easy there big fella. I think being back on AT is taking its toll on you (yeah I saw that B Stinger thread there).

I have been the same guy for years on archery forums. I still support the pros and think we all should learn from them. Nothing changed about me.
Im quite a bit older but the feeling for the pros will never change. I just hate the fact most pros wont post on archery forums because they have nothing to gain and alot of crap to deal with if they do post so why post.
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Old 06-01-2010, 11:52 PM   #45
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Your qoute

DB, easy there big fella. I think being back on AT is taking its toll on you (yeah I saw that B Stinger thread there).

I have been the same guy for years on archery forums. I still support the pros and think we all should learn from them. Nothing changed about me.
Im quite a bit older but the feeling for the pros will never change. I just hate the fact most pros wont post on archery forums because they have nothing to gain and alot of crap to deal with if they do post so why post.
DB
I agree completely on listening and learning from the Pros and wish they'd post more often on topics on forums.

The comment about the AT thread was me saying I know where you're coming from with you trying to take on every person that posted anything negative or questioning, even though many were there just to try to start a fight with you. This isn't that thread though.

I did not post to start any fights with you.
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Old 06-02-2010, 10:34 AM   #46
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This is in no way saying anything bad about the pros. They are trying to make a living like the rest of us.
The only thing I have against the pros is that they will say whatever they need to , to push a paid sponsors product. And I know I will get a bunch of hate mail about saying that and I am sorry. But, it is true. just like one of the big Hoyt names going over to Mathews. While at Hoyt, it was the greatest thing since sliced bread. Now that he is with Mathews, it is the best thing ever. No big deal to me. I shoot what I like but it has to do with this discussion.

The only thing I look at is the product and the average person and also the people I know on a personal level.. I used to hear Stinger this and Stinger that so I tried one. As I have said , it is a great stab. But I just did not like the chunk of metal looK coming off the end. Kind of like a shower curtain.The concept is great. Then the Smooth Stability line came along. Built on the same principle but they opened up (looks like a satellite dish, I know) the end which I liked a lot better. No one was talking about them. But now, they are slowly catching on. But the point is. They work. Just as the Stingers work.
I have read through this thread and stewed on it over night. I know the former "Hoyt Shooter" you speak of....better than you do. If you knew why he switched you wouldn't be making the statement you did. He's a great shooter and knows what he is looking for. It was not "all about the $$$" like you make it seem, but if that is what you want to believe go ahead.....

As well, 99% of Pro's BELIEVE in the products we shoot.....it's not an act. There is too much time and money vested to go out there with inferior equipment. I know I have never put a product on my bow or in my quiver because it was free....I use the product because it works. Simply stated you are misinformed and know far less than you think you know....
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Old 06-02-2010, 10:48 AM   #47
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I agree completely on listening and learning from the Pros and wish they'd post more often on topics on forums.

The comment about the AT thread was me saying I know where you're coming from with you trying to take on every person that posted anything negative or questioning, even though many were there just to try to start a fight with you. This isn't that thread though.

I did not post to start any fights with you.
I was just making a point and if I took your post wrong. I certianly apoligize.
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Old 06-02-2010, 11:03 AM   #48
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I wanted to put my 2 cents in but I just checked my wallet and I am broke. So I am just going to set back and see what I can learn about stabilizers.
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Old 06-02-2010, 11:18 AM   #49
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I have read through this thread and stewed on it over night. I know the former "Hoyt Shooter" you speak of....better than you do. If you knew why he switched you wouldn't be making the statement you did. He's a great shooter and knows what he is looking for. It was not "all about the $$$" like you make it seem, but if that is what you want to believe go ahead.....

As well, 99% of Pro's BELIEVE in the products we shoot.....it's not an act. There is too much time and money vested to go out there with inferior equipment. I know I have never put a product on my bow or in my quiver because it was free....I use the product because it works. Simply stated you are misinformed and know far less than you think you know....

Actually I know far more than anyone thinks I do ( I actually have a family member who is a top level shooter and has won many a shoots). You "think" you know who I am talking about and that is all good. I am glad it got you to thinking.

Business is business. A top level pro is like a walking billboard from the top of their hats (if they wear one) down to their shoes. Manufacturers pay good money to have their names associated with them and to use their product. I am not pointing out any product here , it is done in general.

It is like Nascar. The car is nothing but a big ole billboard. Any name you see on that car is paying to be there. I am in noway telling you these people are lying to you when they say they are good products because, there are no "bad products" out there. I am not holding any agendas against them. I have always said it and will say it again. These top shooters have worked their butts off to get where they are and deserve everything they get.
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Old 06-02-2010, 07:50 PM   #50
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If a pro shooter truely believes that the product they are using is the best out there (and I'm not saying they don't) why do they ever switch brands, after all, they have THE best so why look elsewhere?

Why doesn't 2nd, 3rd and 4th all switch to what #1 is shooting so they can be #1 too?

If I buy every product hawked by a pro shooter, does that mean that I will be as good of a shooter as they are?
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Old 06-02-2010, 08:40 PM   #51
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If a pro shooter truely believes that the product they are using is the best out there (and I'm not saying they don't) why do they ever switch brands, after all, they have THE best so why look elsewhere?

Why doesn't 2nd, 3rd and 4th all switch to what #1 is shooting so they can be #1 too?

If I buy every product hawked by a pro shooter, does that mean that I will be as good of a shooter as they are?
Actually many times they do make the switch. Ole saying of you cant beat them join them.
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Old 06-02-2010, 08:57 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by pred8er View Post
If a pro shooter truely believes that the product they are using is the best out there (and I'm not saying they don't) why do they ever switch brands, after all, they have THE best so why look elsewhere?

Why doesn't 2nd, 3rd and 4th all switch to what #1 is shooting so they can be #1 too?

If I buy every product hawked by a pro shooter, does that mean that I will be as good of a shooter as they are?
This is just an example that I know first hand. Let's say "Joe" is shooting brand X bow. He likes it and is doing good with it. A rep from bow y comes to him and says "I will pay you $6000 a year and give you a limit of 4 bows a year for free along with contingency money if you will shoot for us". Would you take it or pass?
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Old 06-02-2010, 09:11 PM   #53
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This is just an example that I know first hand. Let's say "Joe" is shooting brand X bow. He likes it and is doing good with it. A rep from bow y comes to him and says "I will pay you $6000 a year and give you a limit of 4 bows a year for free along with contingency money if you will shoot for us". Would you take it or pass?
Question would be can he win with it? I have several chances to do contengency and pass. Ill just shot what works for me.
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Old 06-02-2010, 10:12 PM   #54
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Question would be can he win with it? I have several chances to do contengency and pass. Ill just shot what works for me.
DB
He can and does.
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Old 06-02-2010, 10:41 PM   #55
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There no doubt the pros wouldnt have a qlue about what to shoot to win.

Ask Master Celtues wife she a pro. She most likely doesnt shoot whats on her bow because it helps her win.

That darn Levi been lying to me. He said he really like the B stingers. Jeff Hopkins. Whats an archer to do. I think Ill chance and think they actually know what there talking about.

But Ill inform them that most of you here dont believe they shoot the products to win.

Javi he even is shooting them.
DB
Don't get me into this one...

after talking to many people including Blair, I decided to go with the new Doinkers and I'm very pleased with the way they handle and balance..

Blair makes a good product and many of the top folks are using them, but I chose a different route.
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Old 06-03-2010, 03:23 AM   #56
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Don't get me into this one...

after talking to many people including Blair, I decided to go with the new Doinkers and I'm very pleased with the way they handle and balance..

Blair makes a good product and many of the top folks are using them, but I chose a different route.
Glad you like them.
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Old 06-03-2010, 11:02 AM   #57
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If a pro shooter truely believes that the product they are using is the best out there (and I'm not saying they don't) why do they ever switch brands, after all, they have THE best so why look elsewhere?

Why doesn't 2nd, 3rd and 4th all switch to what #1 is shooting so they can be #1 too?

If I buy every product hawked by a pro shooter, does that mean that I will be as good of a shooter as they are?
I know a PRO 3d shooter (who will remain nameless) who recently changed bow companies.....his reason? He needed a change.....he had shot brand X for the last 7 years and hadn't tried anything else out there....money and contract were the same....if not even a little bit of a downgrade...

You guys keep believing it is all about money. I shoot with these guys, compete with them......they are my friends...you all think you have it figured out and that anyone who shoots a bow for a company gets a paycheck....it doesn't work that way....believe what you want....but you are definitely wrong...
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Old 06-04-2010, 05:34 PM   #58
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Originally Posted by asa1485 View Post
This is just an example that I know first hand. Let's say "Joe" is shooting brand X bow. He likes it and is doing good with it. A rep from bow y comes to him and says "I will pay you $6000 a year and give you a limit of 4 bows a year for free along with contingency money if you will shoot for us". Would you take it or pass?
I am by no means a pro shooter. I shoot a 6 year old hunting bow, a 4 year old hunting bow and a 4 year old chrome ally. I do ok though, win some and loose some. No, I wouldn't take it unless I liked the bow company.
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Old 06-04-2010, 05:39 PM   #59
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I know a PRO 3d shooter (who will remain nameless) who recently changed bow companies.....his reason? He needed a change.....he had shot brand X for the last 7 years and hadn't tried anything else out there....money and contract were the same....if not even a little bit of a downgrade...

You guys keep believing it is all about money. I shoot with these guys, compete with them......they are my friends...you all think you have it figured out and that anyone who shoots a bow for a company gets a paycheck....it doesn't work that way....believe what you want....but you are definitely wrong...
I didn't say they were all doing it for the money. But you have to admit that there are definitely some perks to being sponsored. If someone was paying for all my equipment and paying me to practice everyday you can bet that I would be. Now I have to find time because it's something I love to do.

Honestly, I could careless how it all works. I have absolutely no desire to be a "Pro" shooter. I think it would take the fun out of it. Just don't tell me that they all believe 100% that the equipment they are using is the best on the market and that I should buy it just because the "Pro's" say so.

Who's to be believed....guy A who shoots brand X and says it's the best, or guy B who shoots brand Y and says the same thing. Say both have a good variety of wins, then what?
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Old 12-01-2010, 04:15 AM   #60
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I look at it like this, a top level shooter, in any venue, has any and all resources at his or her fingertips. If they wanna shoot something, whether it be an arrow, release, sight, stab system, peep sight, rest, or anything else associated with archery, im sure it's a simple email or phone call away. I think the arguing over who is right or wrong and who knows the most is ridiculous, it's a pissing match and it's completely pointless.

All im saying is, if a professional truly cares about being the best, and can shoot whatever they want, why wouldnt they shoot the best for them, and win....?
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Old 12-02-2010, 07:21 AM   #61
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I have enjoyed this thread almost as much as the "Mr Burns, Shot my last arrow thread". A great debate on stabilizers, might try a B-stinger.
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Old 12-02-2010, 11:55 AM   #62
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DB cool down.

Dietmar told me B-Stingers were hard on his body and didn't like them. Saw him shoot those Fivics like a demon and then a month later won vegas. He's no BStinger fan and he's an alright guy and will give you what he feels is the truth on any topic you want to run by him. He's worked hard to acquire the confidence to evaluate what works for him. Like I imagine most other winning pro's. Now he shoots Doinkers and shooting great.

I think that Pro's can make anything work. Its not the equipment that is getting them there but the will to put the training in to get there.
Isn't D. Christenberry not winning like the Doinker days a couple years back? Is it BStingers fault? Likely not.

B-Stingers are nice, but really, they still have to be set-up to get the bow to do what you want it to do. If it means B-Stingers need 8 ounces up front vs. 10 ounces on a Doinker, so be it. It is what it is.
Pro's don't settle for a sight picture that is less than optimal for the game they are shooting.
No matter what stab., bow, cam etc. etc.
B Stinger kool aid is the latest greatest flavour. Its wet and will quench your thirst like Doinker kool-aid and Shibuya kool-aid......
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Old 12-02-2010, 05:47 PM   #63
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Lets assume that the pros know everything there is to know about archery. Now some are shooting different equipment from the guys that are winning. What is the deal? The pros even shoot bows from different manufactures. They don't all shoot the same strings.

If I was a manufacturer I would expect my staff to promote my product and to never say anything negative about a competitors product. I would also expect them to not point out any features of my competitors product which might be better than my product. I would not expect them to lie about anything but they don't have to tell the whole truth either.

When it comes to archery equipment, I feel like the equipment needs to match the archer. Since the archers are built different from each other it just seems reasonable that they might shoot better if they all didn't use the exact same equipment.

Oh I haven't shot a 300 60x yet so I could be wrong.
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Old 12-17-2010, 11:29 AM   #64
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Your qoute

DB, easy there big fella. I think being back on AT is taking its toll on you (yeah I saw that B Stinger thread there).

I have been the same guy for years on archery forums. I still support the pros and think we all should learn from them. Nothing changed about me.
Im quite a bit older but the feeling for the pros will never change. I just hate the fact most pros wont post on archery forums because they have nothing to gain and alot of crap to deal with if they do post so why post.
DB
have to agree with that post 100%. i talk to jeff hopkins sometimes when he comes into my local archery shop (crazy horse archery) here in campbellsville ky and all i can say is he is a really nice guy.
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Old 12-21-2010, 08:23 PM   #65
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have to agree with that post 100%. i talk to jeff hopkins sometimes when he comes into my local archery shop (crazy horse archery) here in campbellsville ky and all i can say is he is a really nice guy.
And I talk to his daughter all the time at my school. Theyre both really nice.
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